For her last episode, Ruby interviews Jeff Timmermans, Director of the Reynolds Center. Ruby asks poignant questions about what is needed from students looking to get into business journalism and why students should consider the field. Jeff shares with us the importance of business journalism and how you don’t need a finance background to report on and cover the business beat.
Transcript
[Intro music]
Ruby Arora: Welcome to “We Mean Business.” I’m your host, Ruby Arora. This podcast is about something that affects all of us: business. Our culture and society are molded around business and what business leaders want. It impacts our daily lives more than we know. Here at the Reynolds Center we focus on business journalism, and we’re here acting as the liaison connecting business with journalism, allowing journalists to cover business better. Today, our special guest is Jeff Timmermans my boss, my friend. How are you today?
Jeffrey Timmermans: I’m very well. Thanks for inviting me. This is very fun.
Arora: Will you please give us a brief synopsis of your background experiences?
Timmermans: Wow. Okay, so I’m a recovering journalist. I worked for many years for The Wall Street Journal in Dow Jones, primarily in Asia. I did everything from covering the stock market to covering Toshiba and stachi, to interviewing finance ministers in Japan. And then I went to Hong Kong, I was Hong Kong Bureau Chief, and then later moved to Singapore to be managing editor. But in 2007, I left journalism briefly. I went to work for Bain company, the consulting firm, and then decided to do something totally different. I quit my well-paying job and became a student again. I got my PhD in 2016 and have for the last 10 years before I came to ASU, been working at the University of Hong Kong when I ran the undergraduate journalism program.
Arora: What would you say is the biggest difference in the business world in Japan, Hong Kong and then United States?
Timmermans: It’s all, it’s all really, really different. I think, you know, the Japanese business world is quite insular, and there certainly is an issue with business journalists for local Japanese publications being probably a little bit too close to their sources. Their role is somewhat seen as a protector of Japanese business. So you don’t see a lot of negative stories in the local Japanese media. And in fact, some of the most negative stories, and I’m thinking the scandal involving Olympus a few years ago, that actually broke in a non-Japanese publication. So it’s a very cozy world in Japan, much more so than than in the States, where there’s a little bit more of an antagonistic attitude towards companies and sources. For good reason.
Arora: You’ve dipped your toes in PR, teaching journalism in Hong Kong, and now being the director of the Reynolds National Center for Business Journalism. What have been your biggest takeaways pertaining to Business Journalism?
Timmermans: Well, I think it’s, my biggest takeaway is that it’s super important for everybody, and whether you know it or not, whether you like it or not, business journalism affects every aspect of our daily lives. I think it’s really important for people to be financially literate so they can understand how these big economic events affect them and their families. How they can plan for the future. We need business journalists to keep an eye on these companies that we’re sharing our most intimate details with. I’m thinking Instagram and Facebook, Meta. We need someone to help us with this, and that’s what business journalists do.
Arora: You touched on Meta, and now Elon Musk is buying Twitter. How do you think that will change business journalism or Meta even?
Timmermans: Well, it’s hard to say. I mean, I will admit that I did not think Elon Musk would be able to secure the funding to take Twitter private. That was surprising to me. I don’t know if he has a clear business plan for what he intends to do. So it’s hard to say, I really don’t know. I don’t think it will have an immediate impact on the other social media companies. It’s hard to say. You shouldn’t ask me, because I was totally wrong about polling.
Arora: Where can the business journalism world improve? Where have you seen disparities?
Timmermans: Well, I think the biggest issue facing business journals in this country is a lack of diversity, and that’s something that we at Reynolds Center are trying to help foster discussion on. I think, for business journalism to be relevant to everybody, it has to look like everybody, and we have to have people in business journalism who, you know, understand what the public needs and wants to know. And I think diversity is absolutely essential for that. So that’s something we hope to, you know, talk more about in the future and try to foster diversity in the industry.
Arora: A big thing. I’ve noticed a lot of professors I’ve had, or even like people that are older than I am. They didn’t get a degree in business journalism or journalism. And this was back in the 70s and 80s, and they were able to turn out just fine with their lifestyle now, but they’re also white. So would you say in this day and age, and when considering diversity, inclusivity, that a degree is required to go into business journalism?
Timmermans: I don’t necessarily think so. I think, well, you know what I majored in undergrad, right? Did I tell you that?
Arora: No, I don’t remember. What was that?
Timmermans: Japanese, Japanese literature, and a minor in drama. So, you know, I would just, I would just say that your degree is not essential, but I think a liberal arts degree where you’re exploring your intellectual passions, you’re learning more about other people, and especially if you have an opportunity to do a semester or a year abroad, to get experience outside the States. I mean, that’s fantastic. So I think that’s really what a degree can offer. Some of those experiences where you get to know how the world works, and that’s super important for being a journalist in general, but particularly a business journalist, because, like I said in the beginning, you know business works differently in different parts of the world. People act differently, and if you have an understanding of how globalization works, that’s really important.
Arora: What would you like to see more of in the next generation of business journalists?
Timmermans: Well, I just want them to keep growing up, tough, skeptical and curious. I think skepticism, but not cynicism. Curiosity is super important. That’s really all it takes, that and empathy.
Arora: What advice would you give to someone wanting to go into business journalism.
Timmermans: Do it. Just do it. We need good people. We need in a diverse bunch of people do it, and don’t be scared. So many of the students here and people think business journalism is all about numbers. It’s all about money. It’s only for rich people. That’s totally not true. And you don’t need to be a math whiz to be a business journalist. I mean, if you’re financially literate, and I think everybody should be, that’s fine. And one of the great things about a lot of jobs in business journalism, particularly with trade publications, niche publications, I’m thinking things like the city business journals, all those places really help train you as well. You get to be an expert in a particular field. They’ll train you up. You’ll learn on the job, and that’s invaluable.
Arora: One last question, Would you say it’s worth taking a job in business journalism that may be beneficial to you in the future, but the pay is low right now?
Timmermans: Well, pay is just one element of jobs. You know, it has to be, I mean, for me, it has to be a job that I really love, that I think is in some small way helping to make the world a better place. So, you know, it’s not everything. Salary is not everything. Hopefully you get a job that that pays enough you can live a nice life without having to scrimp and save too much. But you know, if you’re going into journalism and you’re smart, you could probably find a job that pays more if that’s what you want. Journalism is not the highest paid profession in the world by any stretch of the imagination. Neither is academia. And you know, look at the faculty at Cronkite. I’d say probably every single one of them could make more doing something besides teaching, but yet we do it because we love it.
Arora: You hear that employers, there’s a disparity in pay and talent, and we would like a bonus.
Timmermans: We want a raise. We all deserve a raise.
Arora: Don’t lowball the new class of people coming in, AKA me. But thank you, Jeff for joining us on my last podcast.
Timmermans: Best of luck. It’s been so much fun.
Arora: The pleasure was all mine. Thank you.
Thanks to everyone for listening. Make sure you subscribe and join us next time, as we talk about more business topics and what journalists need to know.
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